04 Mar 2015 01:50:29
Couple big trades
To Philadelphia
Phil kessel
Peter holland
4th round pick 2016
To toronto
Brayden schenn
Luke schenn
Scott Laughton
2nd rd pick 2016
And then if Edmonton wins mclottery
To Edmonton
Jonathan bernier
Dion phaneuf
James vanriemsdyk
To toronto
Ryan nugget-Hopkins
Darnell nurse
Laurent brossoit
04 Mar 2015 07:25:13
wow, talk about horrible for toronto with that filly one.
2nd line centre (at best)
overpaid 7th defenseman (that was already traded away)
meh prospect
2nd pick
wouldnt even come close to gettign kessel.
04 Mar 2015 11:20:53
Calling Laughton a meh prospect shows how little you know Shankar if you can do a better kessel trade let's see it.
04 Mar 2015 13:01:15
I agree with shanker that this is not enough and either than calling Laughton a meh prospect he is spot on with his other player predictions.
How about leafs: Phaneuf 1.5 - 2 M retained + a mid to low level prospect
Flyers: L. Schenn, Sanheim/Morin/Laughton and a 1st
?
04 Mar 2015 14:02:57
The Philly trade is not good. The EDM trade is equally as bad.
IF EDM wanted Phaneuf:
TOR: Purcell, PIT 1st or EDM 2nd, Klefbom
EDM Phaneuf (1.5 million retained)
**I am not married to the pieces moving in this trade, it's more of an outline. I am not convinced adding Phaneuf makes any sense for EDM, but I will break it down for fun.
Toronto won't move Phaneuf(assumed asking price is a high pick and a good prospect) for nothing and if Toronto keeps salary and takes back salary it's going to cost the other team(one of the reasons a trade to Detroit did not pan out).
From EDM stand point, Nurse won't be moved and neither will EDMs 1st this year or next. So a late 1st and Klefbom make the most sense. Marincin or Musil could also be involved, but I think TO would be looking for something else if that were the case.
04 Mar 2015 16:03:24
I think both trades could help the teams involved and the value is close.
P.s.i know these trades suck, how about you do something useful and tell me why/how?
And don't tell me Edmonton won't move Darnell nurse, I think he will be great and Edmonton wouldn't try to move him but the oilers have been a joke for so long they might do anything they think might fix it.
04 Mar 2015 16:12:26
I like your idea charlesxavier but I think philly would want Tml to take lecavalier in that deal
04 Mar 2015 17:15:43
Yeah I was just trying to think of a bad contract. Schenn, Lecavier, Umberger take your pick.
04 Mar 2015 20:48:28
@leafhate
Shankar pretty much explained why it's a bad trade for Toronto, but here it goes.
1) When Toronto moves Kessel, my guess is they are looking for better upside than the Schenn's and Laughton give them. They also want a 1st round pick.
2) EDM is rebuilding. They aren't moving their young pieces for older veterans that aren't the type of building blocks they need. The value may be close, but it's just an impractical trade.
04 Mar 2015 22:23:27
1 Schenn and Laughton are only two pieces of the trade and they both project as good young top 6 forwards.
That sounds like upside to me.
I'm curious who in the Tml organization said they wanted a first round pick when they trade kessel. That's bs and you know it.
The leafs would likely want young assets ie picks/young players or both in a kessel trade and I'm sure a kessel trade could happen without a first round pick coming back
2 Edmonton has been rebuilding/stockpiling ie sucking forever and last time I checked rebuilds don't last forever
3 Charles x I was thinking two bad contracts coming back in your idea l.schenn and lecavalier coming back in that trade IMO
04 Mar 2015 23:51:52
umm, its quite obvious TOR would want a 1st rounder in a trade involving kessel. and since you brought up an organization saying exactly what they want fro a player, please show me the last time that happened for anyone, nevermind the team's best player.
05 Mar 2015 04:05:57
Maybe a Kessel and a 2nd for Laughton, Umberger, Morin, 1st?
And Edmonton wouldn't trade Nurse or Klefbom straight up for Phaneuf.
05 Mar 2015 10:18:07
@ Shankar you're the one saying the leafs would want a first rd pick back in a kessel trade, I'm not sure how you're confused on this but what I'm saying is that the leafs might trade kessel for a package not including a first rd pick if they can get some good young talent.
Pay attention You brought it up shanky I called it bs
05 Mar 2015 14:18:43
@Leafhate
Shankar is right. Multiple reports have stated that the asking price for Kessel is very high (top prospect, high draft pick, young roster player with upside). If you want to play the semantics game about what a "high draft pick" actually means, go ahead. But at the end of the day it's only logical that TO will want a 1st back for Kessel (unless they are getting back a truly elite prospect, which Schenn and Laughton are not).
As for EDM, yes they have been building forever and yes they still aren't good, but that doesn't mean that they will throw logic and reason out the window to bump their winning percentage up slightly, which will set them back in the long run.
05 Mar 2015 17:12:15
@grn1 sure the leafs would like to get back an elite prospect or first round pick in a kessel deal(I'd like that too) but there's no guarantee they get that back for kessel.
How can you say Shankar is right if the trade hasn't happened yet that makes no sense at all.
As for edm you don't know what they will do but I think they make a big change this offseason and this trade was my idea, what's you're idea.
Do you post ideas of your own or just tell others their ideas are wrong just curious haha
05 Mar 2015 17:38:15
oh man, just stop buddy. if the leafs aren't getting a high end return for kessel he's staying. its literally that simple. he's 27 and has 7 years on his contract after this one.
and no, I wasnt the one that brought up the 1st pick, I defendded the positon but didn't bring it up. you might want to re-read the thread.
05 Mar 2015 19:29:46
1 And I was accused of semantics
2 Phil kessel and Tyler seguin are comparable in a lot of ways, go see what he was traded for and then come back and say this deal can't happen without a elite prospect/first round pick coming to toronto.
3 if you got a better kessel trade idea let's here it, otherwise who are you to say that your opinion is fact.
4 @thegr81 and @shankar either come clean as Stevie y and don cherry or stop pretending you know it all.
05 Mar 2015 20:24:39
@leafhate
Dude, takes Shankar's advice and stop.
05 Mar 2015 21:55:59
@thegrn1 who is you.
Isn't the point of us using this site discussing hockey.
And if so,
People have opinions and sometimes disagreements,
You can say I'm right you're wrong stop talking but that don't make you right and it won't make me shut up.
These trades are not bad or terrible in fact if you take a second to think they make some sense for all the teams involved.
06 Mar 2015 00:12:08
lol @ "who is you"
anyways, they don't make sense in the slightest, for the reasons mentioned above.
06 Mar 2015 12:30:55
Man you guys are way too intense, this is a fun website to make up trades that are our opinion. But at the end of the day no one in this site is a GO in the NHL not now not ever. So everyone should just have fun and chill out.
06 Mar 2015 15:31:28
@ Shankar and the @grn1
^ you both didn't address any of the points I made, you simply keep telling I'm wrong, just because.
@paolazza that's kind of my point here.
Until a kessel trade happens we won't know what the return is. So how is it I'm wrong, shankar is right if the trade hasn't gone down.
I think/hope the leafs try and get elite prospect/high pick in return for kessel.
But there's no guarantee they get that.
Maybe Shankar is Dave nonis and maybe the gr81 travels time and has seen the future but unless they admit to it, they should change their attitudes.
06 Mar 2015 16:19:14
im pretty sure I have mentioned why I disagree with your points, while you have picked and chose what to respond to regarding my posts.
but, give me a list of your points and i'l tell you my position on them with proof, if available and relevant.
06 Mar 2015 16:28:44
and on your main point, which seems to be why don't I make a kessel trade, i'm not going to for the simple reason that high end players are rarely ever traded now and recent history suggests that returns are very inconsistent. so, I could predict something and nonis ends up getting much much more, or much much less.
if you want an outline of a deal i'd be happy with, here it is:
1) under 25 forward, preferrably a c, with some upside, but not an elite player obviously.
2) 1st rounder/very high end prospect
3) a 3rd asset, quality ranging from mid-pick/average prospect to good pick/roster player/high pick - this depends on the the quality of the other 2 assets.
thats just the bare bones of what i'd liek to see, TOR coudl add to better fit the other teams needs, while the other team would also obviously add to offset TOR's add.
06 Mar 2015 18:07:10
In you're first comment Shankar you wrote
"wow talk about horrible deal for toronto" and
"Wouldn't even come close to getting kessel"
And above you list what you be happy with in a kessel deal which looks an awful lot like what I suggested in the first place, and you dumped on,
The difference is I suggested a deal without a first rd pick(my suggestion involved a second round pick.) and a high end prospect instead of a really high end prospect.
And above you write "recent history suggests that returns are very inconsistent when high end players get traded"
Thanks a bunch for an outline of an kessel trade, But I challenged you to post an actual kessel trade.
You tell me I'm wrong but your too scared to even submit an answer.this is a joke.your a joke.
06 Mar 2015 18:26:54
Just seen your 2nd last comment shanka,
I'm here to respectfully discuss hockey,
I'm not going to argue with you just for the sake of argument.
And you're comment
"I'm pretty sure I have mentioned why I disagree with your points, while you have picked and chose what to respond to regarding my points" etc
Makes me sad for you.
The Tyler seguin trade might be comparable to a kessel trade.do you're research.
06 Mar 2015 21:11:06
LOL how is the seguin trade comparable to a potential kessel trade? firstly, TOR is nto in the same siituation BOS was in at the time (legit cup contender) so TOR would have no interest in a guy like eriksson who was the centerpiece of the trade coming back to BOS. also, kessel and seguin (when he was traded at age 21/22) aren't really comparabel either, I don't know how you think they are.
and regarding my proposed kessel trade: b. schenn fits the roster player, yes, laughton does not fit the very very good prospect, fr reasons discussed before, l. schenn does not fit the 3rd asset either because he's an overpaid 7th defenseman that has negative value.
and buddy, I said i'm not going to try to figure out a kessel trade because its 100% an exercise in futility. I gave you an outline of something I personally would be happy with. what the f*** does my opinion matter?
07 Mar 2015 00:25:46
-The seguin to Dallas trade is comparable to a possible kessel trade because they are similar players in a lot of ways.
questionable attitude, elite talent, their statistics.
Do you understand the comparisons.
Kessel is 27 and seguin was 22 when he was dealt I believe. Both elite top end players in their prime who if healthy should finish top 10 in points.
Do you Understand the comparisons yet.
-Eriksson was one of the centrepieces to that trade along with Reilly smith and joe morrow. Boston traded seguin for good peices not a good piece. That's comparable to what I suggested in my trade.
- if you insist on a third asset take another look you forgot to mention the 2nd rd pick involved in my trade.
Do you understand that's an asset.
08 Mar 2015 06:52:17
no, BOS traded seguin for eriksson at the time. with the addition of other secondary pieces.
rielly smith, joe morrow, rich peverley, and anything else involved in that trae were just secondary pieces involved in the trade to make it appealing to both sides at the time.
of coure smith has turned out to be a pleasant surprise for BOS, while eriksson hos been a miseable failure, but you can't look at the trade today and say "oh yeah they traded for rielly smith." they didn't really, he was just a throw out that has turned out to be a pleasant surprise, while the centerpiece of the deal (eriksson) has largely been a failure.
so a kessel trade basd around that would be: 28-30 year old high end 2nd liener/borderline 1st liner + a couple throw ins for kessel and someoen like komarov. that doesn't make sense at all for toronto considering their direction.
i don't know why I still bother wasting my time on you, but you keep annoying me for whatever reason.
08 Mar 2015 13:19:07
Where did I say "oh ya they traded for Reilly smith" that's a complete lie, you're not this dumb so stop playing.
Reilly smith was a big piece coming back not a "throw out " in the deal, the term is throw in so ya know.
I agree toronto would probably want a different return from a kessel trade than the seguin to Dallas trade.no guarantees with only a few serious suitors for kessel.
the point is they have about the same value, and if you look at what seguin was traded for, their was no elite prospects/1st round picks coming back to bruins.
And if you think it makes absolutely no sense to add a 28-30 year old top 6 forward because of the direction of the team you're worse than montreals finest