15 Feb 2015 16:02:57
So much for Franson is worth a 1st and Santorelli is worth a 2nd, dear leaf fans.
Combined, they got a probably very late 1st rd pick, a meh-meh prospect and a cap dumb in Jokinen with rather negative trade value and no value for the Leafs at all.
NICE!
At least, it'll help their tanking.

1.) 15 Feb 2015
Leipsic is actually a very underrated prospect. 2 100+ point seasons in the WHL and 35 points in 47 games in his first AHL Season. For a kid who's 5'10 taken late in the third round, I'd say that's a good snag

2.) 15 Feb 2015
I find it hard to believe they couldn't do better then this the pick is going to be at best 26th overall.preds are probably cup favourites now so that would make it 30th overall.prospect they got back I don't think would be in any teams top 10 prospects.and the icing on the cake good ole olli jokinen.

3.) 15 Feb 2015
Haha! I posted almost the exact same thing on the rumors page! Hilarious.

Sounds like the leafs intend on flipping Jokinen, but still. Nice tank trade by the leafs.

Best part of it is the quote from Darren Dreger on twitter: "Let's just say that Olli Jokinen was less than thrilled when he heard he had been traded to the leafs."

Hysterical!

4.) 15 Feb 2015
@ Drais

The way I have seen a few analyst break the deal is like this:

Franson = 1st (more than what every non-Leaf fan said)

Santorelli = Leipsic, Jokinen

So the only thing "leaf fans" got "wrong" was Santorelli being worth a 2nd (which was the reported asking price from management, not something Leaf fans made up).

Having said that, Leipic was a 3rd round pick who lead the WHL in points the year after he was drafted. His line mate, Nick Petan (most people are familiar with him now) had the same pts that season and was drafted in the 2nd round the year after. In other words, Nashville drafted Leipsic in the 3rd, but he's clearly a better prospect than his draft position.

I would argue that Toronto is further ahead with Leipsic v. a late 2nd round pick given how he has developed to this point.

5.) 15 Feb 2015
Underrated? Some scouts aren't even sure he has the potential to be a full-time NHL player. Take off the rose-colored glasses, buddy.

6.) 15 Feb 2015
@hab

depends on what you mean by "better"? IMO only a cup contending team would be willing to give up a 1st got Franson. So you're limited to 4-6 teams and at least 2 of those teams don't have a 1st. Maybe a lower ranked team would have given a conditional 1st.

As for Leipsic, he's likely a safer bet to be an impact at the NHL level than a late 2nd rounder. Given Toronto's investment in Santorelli (very low) pretty much anything is good value.

7.) 15 Feb 2015
@chirp

Isn't that the definition of being underrated? Ppl thinking you're worse than you are? And most of those scouts point to his size being the biggest obstacle, which is starting to become a bit of an archaic thought process

8.) 15 Feb 2015
15 Feb 2015 17:22:48
lol its actually a really solid deal. franson I've said forever is worth a late 1st, and that prospect is the equivalent of a 2nd/3rd which has long been said to be santorelli's value.

9.) 15 Feb 2015
For the record I don't have expectations for Leipsic. But I don't see how people think getting a late 2nd is better value. He's already shown that his skill is better than his draft position

10.) 15 Feb 2015
Defining "underrated" for me? Jeez. Leafs fans talk like politicians. Apparently "likely unsuccessful" = "underrated."

11.) 15 Feb 2015
@chirp

Again, as my post above says I have no expectation for Leipsic. All I was pointing out was the reason his ability to play at the next level is being challenged is bc of his size. And this way of thinking is starting to become more and more outdated.

12.) 15 Feb 2015
Good luck trying to get through to "mouth" & "drais". The worse the leafs do is just eating away at them. Heaven forbid the leafs get a decent pick. The oilers have multiple 1st rounders, looking for another. You can analyze this trade however you want. The deal is very close to what leaf fans were posting. For not being an actual GM and considering this site is for fun, not too bad. I could be wrong but I rarely ever see either one post a trade. They just criticize everyone else for being morons. Now that's hilarious! Good day

13.) 15 Feb 2015
Are you slow? "so much for franson being worth a 1st and santorilli a second"

That is basically exactly what they got. Read the trade again you plug.

14.) 15 Feb 2015
Leafs17 with the absolute zinger. Yawn.
The oilers suck, that's why they get high picks. And they're mismanaged. No room for success there, that's why I stopped watching games. The leafs, while I don't like them, are clearly better. But then they mysteriously fire their coach while in playoff contention and use a system that clearly doesn't work with an inexperienced coach and plummet to the earth? And during a season where 2 generational players are up for grabs at the draft? Hmm. Odd. And convenient. Sorry, but I just don't appreciate a team disrespecting the game and the league by intentionally taking a nose-dive to get a high pick. But maybe that's just me not living in a fantasy world.

15.) 15 Feb 2015
Good luck signing Stamkos too, bud. Yeh, leafs fans aren't deluded at all.

16.) 15 Feb 2015
I don't understand how all you leaf haters can be laughing at this trade?

i don't mind it in the slightest, opens up some cap for next year, prospect could pan out, from what I read he plays with an edge, small but tough, can clearly put up points, who knows and the first in a deep draft for guys the leafs were going to let walk to free agnecy anyway

id have taken anything decent for those 2 rentals at this point.

if they flip olli to someone for a 3rd or 4th all the better

17.) 15 Feb 2015
Leipsic actually looks like a decent prospect + a 1st. Its to bad they took onJokinen, but all in all , a decent trade for a UFA and Santoreli.

18.) 15 Feb 2015
Chirp, the leafs are/ have been just as mismanaged as the oilers. the leafs have had 3 coaches and 3 gms in the last 5-6 years. the leafs just don't have the 3 first overalls to show for it.

19.) 15 Feb 2015
If they were as mismanaged, they'd have been bottom-dwellers like the Oilers. The oilers, who started the 2014/15 season with 2 legit centers. The oilers, who ruined players like Gagner, paajarvi, etc by rushing them instead of letting them develop. The oilers, who let a boys club skim the bottom of the barrel for a couple years and then promote those same people to higher executive positions. The oilers, who went thru coach after coach after coach, and when one finally worked (Kreuger), fired him via Skype only to replace him with arguable the worst coach so far (Eakins) who they signed to a 4-yr contract without him having a second of NHL experience.

Please. Let's not compare the two. Leafs have had their troubles, surely, but the oilers are a joke in the executive branch. It's not even close.

20.) 15 Feb 2015
15 Feb 2015 22:10:03
chir use whatever little bit of a brain it is you have and consider this: if the leafs were tankign wouldn't they have done it from the start of the year, not start 40% of the way through? now please, come up with more useless jargon to try to counter that.

21.) 15 Feb 2015
Leafs mgmt made moves in the off-season, saw it didn't work well enough by Dec (playoff contention, but we all know they wouldn't have gone far), so they fire the coach and give the reigns to a clueless nobody, and let the nosedive begin with hopes of getting Mc or E. No matter how you wanna perceive it, the tank is intentional. Clearly. If you can't see that, I feel sorry for you. It's not your fault, I'm not blaming you or anything, you just happen to cheer for a team that is doing something despicable. That's all.

22.) 16 Feb 2015
You mean like when the leafs fired jfj and replaced him with the previously fired cliff fletcher befoe burke was hired and the team was bought by bell and rogers who fired burke before he could finish what he started, replacing him with his yes man assistant who has no real power before hiring shanahan as president

the leafs rushed schenn and ruined him, kadri too for the most part.

the leafs have been mismanaged just as badly, not making the playoffs for how many years, come on man, they're just as bad as the oilers without the top picks.

23.) 16 Feb 2015
I respect your opinions for the most part, Ovie, but I don't get how you can compare the two. They were as mismanaged without gaining top picks? Then how were they AS mismanaged?

24.) 16 Feb 2015
Its pretty simple actually, not black and white. there's mismanged and bottom dweeling and getting top picks and then there's mismanaged and a decade of coming in 9-12th in the conference and not making playoffs and also not getting top picks, its worse then the oilers situation actually. mediocrity isn't kind to the nhl, at least the oilers got some pieces out of it. what have the leafs gotten out of a decade of medicrity though the draft? rielly? kadri? and those are the highest picks they had out of all those years of mediocrity, a 5th and a 7th overall

25.) 16 Feb 2015
16 Feb 2015 18:59:03
@ovie: I think they got a decent return. that's not my point. But many on here were like Franson is worth a 1st+ and Santorelli at least a 2nd. And obviously, they didn't quite get that.

26.) 16 Feb 2015
You know that many leaf fans on here are window lickers and shouldn't represent us as a whole

27.) 17 Feb 2015
17 Feb 2015 10:20:42
@ovie: I know you're not all the same. You and Adam are the best examples.
But you can't disagree that a huge number (% wise) of leaf fans are so so so delusional when it comes to accessing their own team and their players trade value. Sure, everyone has a little bias towards their team, that's human. But I truly feel Leaf fans are the worst in that regard. And that's not only because of this site, it's also things I read below facebook posts from Hockey Rumors and Trades (or sth like that). Some of this is even worse than things on here.
The worst part of it probably is, that these people truly believe in what they're saying/posting.

Whatsoever, I do know there are reasonable leaf fans, just like every team has "good" and "bad" fans.

28.) 18 Feb 2015
Oh I know, its horrible, every first rounder is the second coming of gretz or bobby orr, buts its the medias fault. the media is so bad its not even funny drais. tsn and sportsnet have been lambasting this team for weeks talking about trade percentages for every player and stuff like that every single day every single hockey related broadcast. I understand why a lot of players wouldn't want to play here, especially in this day and age where everything is on the internet and up for discussion. its never going to get any better, the media will always get worse.